Game Of Thrones S2 episode discussion BOOK READERS WITH SPOILERS

[kahless]

Originally Posted by Knappos

Also, where the producers said there'd be a character die in season 2 that didn't in the books, I'm sure we're in excess of 2 now.

I read what the producers/writers said as someone dies who didnt die at all, in any of the books not just ACoK.

Early deaths so far (in fact the last 2 episodes), the Tickler, Amoury Lorch and Rodrik Cassel.

[mini_beastie]

Was Iri dead at the end of the end of episode? It looked like she might be I suppose she could just be injured. If so that would be a change as she's still around in ADWD (although she doesn't do much). That said, I seem to remember the other handmaiden (who's name I can't remember) dies in the first book. But I could be mixing them up. It's been a while since I read ACOK so I'm not picking up on all the changes. Still I quite like not knowing exactly what's going to happen. It feels like most of the major plot points are still on track even if they are making some changes.

[Knappos]

Ah, early death versus new/TV show only (at this point...) death.

Dunno if Iri was dead but Rakharo counts. Sure he was in A Dance With Dragons.

If it isn't Rakharo though, this could be sweep stake material...

If he wasn't minorly vital next season, I'd put money on Dontos.

Who else could be in danger?

Rickon anyone? Baelish?

Not Podrick?!

[kahless]

Hmmmm...Jamie's killing of Alton is an interesting deviation from the books, although Alton is a TV only character it does radically change Jamie's character for me, and I'm guessing a lot of TV only viewers.

In the books I know he was always portrayed as this self-centred, cold-blooded killer. But underneath I always saw Jamie as having a conscience, having some moral code, he did what he did - to the Mad King, Bran, Ned - because he believed he did it for the right reasons. Killing his cousin just so he could escape is not something I believe book-Jamie would ever have done.

I cannot see the reasoning behind him having to do it, he could have quite easily just knocked Alton out - or have Alton pretend he was - to entice the guard into the cage. And unfortunately this incident again shows how incompetent Northern soldiers appear to be - ie: Ned's guards killed at brothel/Ned's guards killed in throne room without lifting a finger - makes you wonder how the hell they are winning all these battles if they're so thick.

I know Jamie redeems himself later on in the books, but I'm not sure how they are going to work that into the TV series, or even if they are.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by vonbloodbath

Yes, the Reeds! That's what was missing! I knew something was bugging me about Bran and Rickon's escape. I wonder if they're just being done away with, or if they'll meet them on the road?

I think this is the only change that grating with me a bit because not having the Reeds means Rickon and Bran will have to stay together and Bran would just have to make lots of discoverys by himself because Hodor is not that usefull.

[kahless]

Judging by a conversation I saw on Twitter, regarding a comment Renly made about the North ending at Moat Cailin, it would seem that perhaps the Reeds, the Neck and Greywater Watch have been cut totally.

In the books the Neck is part of the North, by Renly saying the North ends at Moat Cailin - which looking at the maps is north of the Neck presumed location of Greywater Watch - I think its safe to assume the Reeds are out.

This of course does mean that there will have to be a different direction taken going forward in Bran's story. I'm wondering if perhaps something happens to Rickon - who lets be honest has done pretty much nothing in the 5 books so far - leaving Bran free to carry on North with Osha in place of the Reeds.

Of course what we don't know is whether Rickon becomes important in the remaining books, Davos has been sent to find him, perhaps with what happens to Bran beyond the Wall (and whatever Jon's fate is) Rickon will be the last surviving male Stark.

[peanut]

Originally Posted by kahless

I'm wondering if perhaps something happens to Rickon - who lets be honest has done pretty much nothing in the 5 books so far - leaving Bran free to carry on North with Osha in place of the Reeds.

Rickon does pretty much just disappear but there is only so much you can do with such a young child. Without the Reeds Osha would be the best choice for Brans guide but theyd have to loose Rickon. I suppose they could just find somewhere safe for him to stay on route or even take him with them north of the wall.

[mini_beastie]

I am beginning to suspect that Tywin might kick the bucket this series. He's getting pretty close to figuring out who Arya is (if he hasn't already) and if he does they can't keep him around without seriously changing her story. Also the way he goes in the books is probably a bit undignified for an actor of Charles Dance's standing!

I think they will probably find some way to off-load Rickon without killing him. That way if Davos does find him in four series time or whatever they could always cast another actor if necessary. Mind you, in the books, whenever someone sets out to find someone else they never seem to manage it.

[kahless]

Originally Posted by mini_beastie

I am beginning to suspect that Tywin might kick the bucket this series. He's getting pretty close to figuring out who Arya is (if he hasn't already) and if he does they can't keep him around without seriously changing her story.

Been having the same thoughts myself, I'm also wondering if her choosing him as the third death will mean they accelerate Arya's story as well. The title of the last Episode is Valar Morghulis, now does this relate to Jaqen giving Arya the coin and phrase or to her using it a whole book early to escape Westeros after Tywin's death?

Originally Posted by mini_beastie

Also the way he goes in the books is probably a bit undignified for an actor of Charles Dance's standing!

I dunno, I think it would make it more effective.

[Knappos]

Originally Posted by kahless

In the books I know he was always portrayed as this self-centred, cold-blooded killer. But underneath I always saw Jamie as having a conscience, having some moral code, he did what he did - to the Mad King, Bran, Ned - because he believed he did it for the right reasons. Killing his cousin just so he could escape is not something I believe book-Jamie would ever have done.

Except that Jamie's 'doing it for the right reasons' reasoning means that he must be at the side of his Sister and their children.

Killing a distant relative to help him to escape to get on his way back to them at King's Landing - totally justifiable to Jamie as he currently is. It's not until right at the end of ASoS and during/after AFfC that Jamie starts redeeming himself to the point of realising that his tunnel vision for Cersei has been ever so slightly wrong.

Originally Posted by mini_beastie

I am beginning to suspect that Tywin might kick the bucket this series. He's getting pretty close to figuring out who Arya is (if he hasn't already) and if he does they can't keep him around without seriously changing her story. Also the way he goes in the books is probably a bit undignified for an actor of Charles Dance's standing!

If Charles Dance is anything of an Actor (and he is), the tragic irony of 'the man who sh*ts gold' dying on the loo as a result of circumstances of his own making will be a joy to play.

Him and Maisie are stealing every episode. They're as good as Bron and Tyrion in totally different ways. Either he or Maisie better get somw award recognition this year!

Anyone notice that Tywin gave Arya the advise that Bolton gave Theon in ADwD about my lord & m'lord in this ep?

I am thinking/hoping that the Reeds will be met along the road in the next couple of eps. I also have a feeling that Rickon will be going with Osha as in the books because I think Davos will be a bit more successful than Brienne and Jamie and, books-wise, it looks like Bran could be staying put, so Rickon will be the male heir to Winterfell.